Wednesday, November 14, 2012

#Syria New Type Of Shoulder Mounted Surface To Air Missile Captured


Possible Score for  n Rebels: Pictures Show Advanced Missile Systems  … … *Russia n SA-16  … …
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New Type Of Shoulder Mounted Surface To Air Missile Captured By The Opposition

During the conflict in Syria a great deal of attention has been paid to SA-7 shoulder mounted surface to air missiles, but these are not the only type of shoulder mounted surface to air missiles in the hands of the Syrian military. 

Until now there's been no evidence of these systems being captured by the opposition, but this picture shows one system, an SA-16, that was reportedly captured by Ansar al-Islam from an air defence in East Ghouta, near Damascus




Currently there's very little other information about the equipment captured, with no indication of the number of systems captured, and while it appears the battery is present it's unclear if the grip stock is also present.

Update November 13th Another new type of surface to air missile has been spotted, apparently looted from Babla Base air defence base by Ansar al-Islam, and interestingly this appears to be anSA-24 system,  the latest generation of Russian surface to air missiles



It's also been pointed out to me it appears to be the same man holding both missile systems.

Update November 14th Thanks to @penym2 who has noted that the word on the gripstock of the SA-24 might be "MAKET", the Russian word for mock-up, although it's not possible to be 100% sure due to the quality of the photograph.

The Damascus Tribune blog has also been able to gather some more details on the base attacked 
After some research I found out that they were captured from Bala Air Defense Base near Mleiha town of Damascus Suburbs in Eastern Ghouta (Not Babla) by Ansar al-Islam as they said in a statement they issued on their Facebook page.  
Update November 14th Thanks to Steve Zaloga who emailed me some very interesting information on the SA-24 pictured

When a country buys a MANPADS system, they get a standard package which includes several different types of training missiles. One type is a simple, non-functional cut-away dummy which is used to train operators on the basic construction of the weapon. They also get some non-functional models which are used for very simple training (pointing, etc.) The most elaborate type is a functional trainer which operates like the real thing and has a functioning seeker (but not a warhead or rocket motor) so that the trainee can understand what happens when they operate the real thing. The most elaborate type is a trainer that hooks into a desk-top computer simulator where the computer can be used to generate targets that are viewed on a small video device attached to the gripstock.

I can’t tell from your photo, but it would seem to be one of the functional trainers, and not a simple dummy. On these MANPADS, the gripstock (the lower section with the trigger, thermal battery and electronic package) is reusable, while the missile in its launch tube/transport tube, and the thermal battery are replaced for each launch.

BTW, the Russian word Maket is borrowed from the French (maquette) and means “Model” rather than mock-up. Maket is painted on Russian training weapons  so that troops don’t confuse them with the real thing. Likewise, they are often painted in a different color (such as silver) for the same reason.

I have no specific details on what Syria has purchased in recent years. The Russians do not usually list their sales on the UN Arms Register, or if they do, it is limited to some very generic data (160 missiles, vs. 160 Igla-S, etc). The fact that the Syrians have the gripstock trainer strongly suggests that they got it  as part of a package with the functional weapons.

Possible Score for Syrian Rebels: Pictures Show Advanced Missile Systems

By C.J. CHIVERS
Rebels opposed to President Bashar al-Assad who have lamented for much of this year the difficulties of fighting the Syrian Air Force have displayed two new weapons that could alter their antiaircraft campaign. In photographs recently posted online, two fighters were shown holding modern variants of heat-seeking, shoulder-fired antiaircraft missiles.
The Brown Moses blog, which has been carefully following videos that have circulated from the Syrian conflict, put up a post a short while ago detailing what the blogger, Eliot Higgins, described initially as SA-14 and SA-24 antiaircraft missiles.
Matt Schroeder, an analyst following missile proliferation at the Federation of American Scientists, was almost certain that the SA-24 description was correct, but he questioned the first call, saying that the system identified as an SA-14 actually appears to be an SA-16. (Mr. Higgins has since updated his post to label the first missile as an SA-16.) The importance of these finds is the same either way, because rebel acquisition of any such new-generation missile, be they SA-14s, SA-16s, SA-18s or SA-24s, would be a significant upgrade. Previously, rebels have been seen only with SA-7s, an earlier, much less capable variant in the former Soviet Union’s suite of portable heat-seekers.
It has long been known that the Syrian military possessed more than SA-7s, and proliferation experts and security analysts have worried over the potential risks to commercial aviation if these missiles slipped from state hands. So this development, the apparent capture of complete SA-16 and SA-24 systems, will bear watching. If these weapons are turned toward Syrian military aircraft, then supporters of the uprising will have reason to hail them, and Syrian military pilots will have new grounds for worry on their next sorties. But if these are sold — and weapons of this sort are often said to fetch four- and five-figure dollar sums on black markets — and fired at commercial aircraft, then the consequences and regional security implications of the war in Syria will have become much worse.
This is especially true if the second missile really is an SA-24, one of the world’s most modern heat-seeking missiles and the subject of quite a scare this year in Libya, as we wrote about on At War in May.
It is too soon to know how this ends. But for now, one of the pictures freshly circulating from Syria is an apparent new marker in the missile proliferation. As Mr. Schroeder notes, “As far as I know, this is the first SA-24 Manpads ever photographed outside of state control.”
Posted by Robby Ball at 7:08 PM